Sunday, July 09, 2006

Emerging church, Purpose Driven, What's Next, Help!

Let me start off by saying that I am so gald Italy won! Wow. What a game! What a game! I thought Italy played friendly the entire time. France on the other hand...Did anyone see wht Frances captain did to get the red card? Crazy. I am glad Italy won. I have some Italian food to celebrate.

On another subject, as a minister I want to do the will of God when it comes to church, worship and ministry. I understand that God is the one that has called me, I serve Him, He is the one I long to please. It is His chruch bought with the highest price of His one and only. So I want to do my ministry the best I can. Pleasing God. I am sure ministers understand what I am saying. I was looking at a lot of blogs that talk about he emerging church and how the emerging church is a good idea. What is it all about really? Will someone explain it. I try to find what it is about and can't really understand it. Will it work in most churches? What about churches who are Purpose Driven can they adopt the emerging church idea without changing? A few years ago it was the Purpose Driven church? What is next? Will there be a new trend of doing ministry down the road? As ministers does this make you frastrated? When we learn one way to do church another idea comes along...what should be our pattern or our guide to doing ministry and church work? What do you think?

501 comments:

  1. God is trying to unite His body, and it doesn't matter if we feel comfortable with it or not. It is something that God desires. =)
    (I know that God has been doing this in me too and pulling me out of my comfort zone in a big way) We all have a function in the body. So, when we come together, we work as one. No more division, no more backbiting or slandering our brother and sisters in the Lord. No more offense toward those who have hurt us. There is no time for that. We are striving for the Kingdom of God. I picture an army, ready, willing and strong. We can't be strong if one leg is over there saying, "Sorry, but my ways are better than yours!" or an arm is screaming, "I don't like how they work for God!" Whatever it is, we need to get before the Lord like no other time, and intercede for the body of Christ. Ask God to bring down walls so that we can come together. Our goal is those that are outside of the 4 walls who need Jesus. Our goal is the hurting, the widows, the orphans. We are to bring Jesus to them. It isn't about how we conduct church in the building, it is about how we conduct our church out there.
    We have been divided for too long.


    Preacherman, great post! =)

    ReplyDelete
  2. Preacherman,

    When a minister or eldership tries to implement a new plan where does their focus lie? The focus is on the plan. How does the church measure success? By their ability to execute the plan.

    I don’t want to measure my success by my ability to institute a plan or program that I got from someone else. When I do that how I measure success becomes skewed.

    In the parable of the talents the servants take what the master gives and two of the three put it into action. The master measures their success not by the others, but by their desire and willingness to use and increase what the master specifically gave them.

    The master is not angry with the third because he was unable to mimic what the other two did. He was angry because he didn’t put his talent into action.

    I agree that we should be emergent churches but that is not a formula. I believe we should find out what is emerging in our community and our culture. Some of these emergent churches that you read about are located in arts districts of bigger cities. It stands to reason that those people will really connect with the arts.

    What happens when I am in a small town in the panhandle of Texas? What if rodeo is their first love? Not sure candles are going to be all that important.

    We worked at being one of the most emergent churches in the area. I was able to create inspiring services with multi-media mixed with candles and incense. It was some of the most moving worship I have ever experienced.

    The problem was it was killing our church. People didn’t want it. People didn’t understand it and it was not helping people grow closer to God. As far as the formula goes I had it all. I was able to do it all. I did it all. We were emergent to the nth degree.

    The church didn’t grow, instead it began to die. Since I abandoned trying to implement the formula and started seeing people I have done greater kingdom work, and we don’t look a thing like emergent. People have been baptized into Christ, the lost have found a place to return and God is being glorified.

    It may not make for a cool book but it is me putting my talents into action.

    ReplyDelete
  3. For some reason, I've never heard of the Emergent Church philosophy.

    I'm guessing from the comments of others that it's churches coming together to join each other in the body of Christ. If that's the case, I think it's awesome!

    Just like The Purpose Driven Church was a marketing tool to get people attending services, that sounds what this is from what I can tell. Marketing programs aren't bad in themselves, but they must be kept fresh in a culture that's ever increasingly changing.

    But the question with marketing tools, must be (and I'm going to sound a bit like Rick Warren on this one) What is the purpose for the marketing? For the church to grow? or for hurting souls to be healed? or is one a means to another?

    ReplyDelete
  4. And I can't believe that guy from France headbutted the guy from Italy!

    I don't remember soccer ever being that violent.

    ReplyDelete
  5. Check out the last few post at Patrick Meads blog and see how his congregation is putting into practice the incarntional approach to reaching groups for the Lord.
    http://www.patrickmead.blogspot.com/

    ReplyDelete
  6. My philosophy for ministry can be stated in several ways, one of which is Peter's words in 1 Pt. 4.11b. He insists that "whoever serves, as one who serves by the strength that God supplies--in order that in everything God may be glorified through Jesus Christ."

    I've been part of at least one church that was serving as "one who serves by the strength that a well crafted marketg strategy provides." The market stategy, the men behind it, the church model--they got the glory for the tiny successes.

    God is serious about being glorified and He wants us to lead His people to brag on Him (rather than us!). Therefore, I'd start with much prayer, congregational fasting and more prayer, waiting, and then follow His movements. Let Him lead as you serve Him in His strength. Glorifing Him will then become second-nature.

    I'll be happy we're no longer Purpose Driven, Emerging, Restorationists, etc.--I long for a day when we will just be God-glorifying communities in Christ, empowered by the Holy Spirit of God burning in our midst!

    Ben

    ReplyDelete
  7. Preacherman,
    On my take on the emerging church movement, scroll down my sidebar to "Future or Fad?" and you'll see my article. I wrote it about this time last year.

    Purpose-driven is only slightly related: emering is missionally-oriented.

    ReplyDelete
  8. I found your blog through ben's. My parents went to Abilene High and I love the Eagles. I know several people who go to LCU. I went to ACU. It is so crazy how small this worl seems to be.

    ReplyDelete
  9. When the church stops changing, it smells like a baby who stops changing.

    If you catch the drift. :)

    ReplyDelete
  10. I appreciate everyone's comments in adding to this discussion. I think Scot McKnights blog www.jesuscreed.com and click on Fad or Future really does explain what The Emerging Church is about. I believe that we are to grow in Christ as Christians. We are to to His will. I believe that is we are not growing we in the likeness and will of God there is something wrong.
    Purpose Driven may work in some churches.
    Emerging church may work in some churches.
    Each church has to decide what will work for it.
    No doubt about it we are to be light to the world. We are to let our lights shine before men. We are to evangelize. Jesus has given us a great commission. We are to make disciples. Making disciples takes time, building relationships, building trust, etc. Does real evanglism come from what we do in our worship services? Is that what our worship is about? Worship is all about God, who he is and what he has done for us. The focus isn't on me, or seekers, or form, it is on God. Most people who are unchurched, non-Christian feel real uncomfortable walking inside a church building. Most won't. Is adding things (candles, incense,multi-media, etc.) our worship services going to make a differnce on the outside as far as evangelism? Are we focusing on form or the function of the church. Is it form of worship? Or is it the function of the church (showing grace, love, kindness, mercy, patience, lending a helping hand without requesting anything in return, meeting needs:feeding needy,giving out diapers,paying a bill that someone needs,visiting people in hospital and praying over them, listening to the brokenhearted and lonely) that is going to move people to accept Jesus?. Real ministry, real evangelism I believe isn't form or what we do in our buildings during worship, but how we function as a body in Christ. We have been called to live the Christian life and offer that way of living to those who are dead. Jesus said, "I have come that they might have life and have it abundantly."

    ReplyDelete
  11. Scot McKnights blog is www.jesuscreed.org
    Sorry that I got the website wrong earlier.
    Just go down the toolbar and click on Fad or Future.
    Again, an excellent read.
    I found it very helpful in understanding what the emerging church movement is about.

    ReplyDelete
  12. Anonymous3:15 PM

    Scot,
    What a great article.

    ReplyDelete
  13. One of the things is that you notice that the church is constantly in a state of evolution. How many different denominations are there....a lot.
    Why is that? In some cases it is because people once they get it right start to focus on the traditions and not on thier relationship with Jesus. Their church does incense......or stained glass windows....or is very spartan but they have Harvest Festivals in the fall. They are connected to the form of religion.
    I came from an Episcopal background and the only person in the whole congregation that ever talked about God was the minister on Sundays. It was a cultural thing, it was not spiritual. The bottom line is that they are following traditions and other men but they are not really following Jesus. "From the fig tree learn its lesson: as soon as its branch becomes tender and puts forth its leaves, you know that summer is near." Matt 24 Tender is the thing that attracts. A real spiritual love for God and others and yourself attracts and brings others in. Summer comes and then the Harvest. Old and stodgy religion does not bring in new people. I went to a church that is still doing barbershop quartet music. Great stuff for the 1880's but it is not reaching this generation. The fact that they are still doing that and not morphing into something that is relevant is not really reflective of God's heart. There was a funeral for a young kid and someone said....."isnt it sad when the only thing that will get young people into the church is when one of them dies." Emergent is God's way of reaching to those who are outside of the church culturally and can not relate to those inside the walls. You can either stay inside the castle or you can leave its safety and try and figure out the fight outside the walls. That is where the battle is.

    ReplyDelete
  14. Hebron,

    Great comments.
    Thanks for your insights.
    I especially agree with your statement "Real spiritual love for God and other and yourself attracts and brings others in." Amen.
    I believe with all of my heart that God's desire for his people is not to stay in castle but go outside and bring others into His love and safety. That's what Christianity is all about.
    Thank you for visiting my blog and adding to the discussion.

    ReplyDelete
  15. Here's what I would add.. Go to http://www.lifestream.org/transition/transition.html and listen to Wayne Jacobsen's podcasts...

    Peace to you as you sort through this...

    ReplyDelete
  16. I think that ministry is desciples making disciples. that is what Jesus did and so did the apostles. I hear people saying that "God gave me a gift of " this ministry or that ministry and instead Paul worked with his hands and very few if any example of a fully supported "Full time"preacher minister is in the new testament at all are we afraid of loosing our job or more concered with finding a true profession of making disciples and getting a real job.

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